User talk:Eep/SL History Wiki
__TOC__ contributions Dear Eep, I'm sure I speak for everyone here when I say that the volume and quality of your contributions are an asset to this wiki. But please do not let this perceived status be an excuse to antagonize other contributors :) Also, while we all recognize and appreciate the logic behind your contributions, I would suggest that you post any widespread changes or initiatives up for discussion on the future plans page. We aim to follow the wikipedia model for a democratic, team-oriented community effort where everyone is welcome and equal. So non-trivial things should be first discussed and voted on :) Eggy 10:29, 26 May 2006 (EDT) :What happened to the "just add it and it'll get sorted out later" mentality? Or is this the "sorting out" part where we play politicians and lobby for our ideas? If you're referring to my creating pages for basic SL terms (build, rez, client, etc), I've already discussed this on Talk:Future_plans_for_the_wiki--and you even agree to interwiki redirect linking (but perhaps you didn't understand what I meant--not a page for generalized definitions that duplicate what the other wikis say, but just LINKS to those wiki pages). As for spelling and duplicate linking, that's just nitpicking but it does get annoying after a while... Other than that, I don't know what other "widespread changes or initiatives" you're referring to. :As for following the Wikipedia model, I don't like some of its anal-retentiveness--particuarly when it comes to section title capitalization (only first letter of first word instead of EACH non-preposition word as proper English is) and disambiguation (like the Eep page I tried to create with references to "Eep"--and, no, it wasn't vanity; I was simply being thorough and saving people from having to search for them--sort of like a linkfarm but it also had content about some "Eep" references). I'd like to think THIS wiki is more open-minded... :-Eep 16:25, 26 May 2006 (EDT) redirects Eep, instead of creating articles like that "1.0" one, just link to the actual article of Version 1.0. Same for stuff like that AVATARS one. The thing of having redirects from common other usages of a word or misspellings etc. is fine, but some stuff that would rarely be used in other cases can just use the actual links instead. Try and avoid redirects where possible and not just put brackets around every term but add what it would redirect to if you were to do it. Only do them if its really nessisary. And I'll try and watch out for that possession stuff more often, I catch it sometimes and othertimes don't. :/ -Oz Spade 03:25, 6 Jun 2006 (EDT) :While I agree with you on "AVATARS", I believe "1.0" is used enough to warrant a redirect (as would "SL 1.0"). -Eep 03:31, 6 Jun 2006 (EDT) ::How do you know that? Plus if you go by that way, then all versions should have a redirection to thier page from thier version number (do not start doing that!). I think people could figure out to go to Release Notes for that kinda information. ::-Oz Spade 03:34, 6 Jun 2006 (EDT) :::Oddly, this wiki's search doesn't show any results for "1.0" but Google's results do. I tried to narrow it to only "1.0" without other numbers after it but it doesn't seem to work. I don't particularly feel like changing ALL those "1.0" links to "1.0"--do you? "1.0" would be SO much easier... Again (as I've stated elsewhere), redirects exist for a reason so why not use them? What's the big deal? -Eep 03:47, 6 Jun 2006 (EDT) Stop doing this stuff... * Creating redirect pages to pages that don't exist yet. What purpose does this serve? Wait untill the page exists THEN create the page. : Ever heard of framework? No, of course not; you can't organize worth shit. :) -Eep 06:29, 21 Jun 2006 (EDT) * Creating pages that aren't even stubs. They NEED MORE CONTENT than three or two words or a link. I'm not kidding about this Eep, a large portion of the pages you create fall under this and you need to stop doing it. : So what? EXPAND THEM! Don't mindlessly delete them. Again, they are FRAMEWORK. -Eep 06:29, 21 Jun 2006 (EDT) * Provide more explination on images and links to the articles they go to. Such as Image:Camera-edit.png, needs more details about what this image is. -Oz : Er, so add more content to them, Oz. I'm simply setting up the framework (as how the LSL Wiki is). Note the following links about specific file formats on the LSL Wiki and how EACH extension has its own page. Until such content exists on THIS wiki, I simply redirect to the category the file extension falls under (images under texture, sounds under sound, animations under animation, etc). Why are you so opposed to this style of linking? Geez. Please stop being a wiktator. As for image info and links, each image page lists what page the link is used on. Anyone interested in learning more about the image can simply browse the pages it's used on. I don't think regurgitating what is easily discernable with even the most basic of curiousity was necessary here. -Eep 02:18, 8 Jun 2006 (EDT) :: I don't care "what structure" you're doing or what the LSL wiki does, I'm telling you what to not do. I'm not a "wiktator", I'm an admin and you are not following the guidlines we have set, read the help pages, what you're adding is not sufficient content. END OF STORY. So stop doing it. I've told you before 3 times to stop doing this kind of thing and you keep doing it anyway. It's not just about me adding content, its also about breaking "wanted pages" by creating pages that have in actuality no content on them, as well as totaly not following the help rules/guidlines. The image info, you can't expect people to follow page names, you need to provide more information about what that image is of, your page names aren't even that easy to follow anyway. Oz Spade 19:14, 8 Jun 2006 (EDT) ::: Oz, you're way out of line here. Be nice. oO ::: In the interest of transparency, I would like to note that that "We" up there certainly didn't include me. Oz and I had a bit of an argument on IRC and I specifically told him to leave you alone. Maybe in the interest of avoiding further conflict I could help negotiate a compromise between you two. :::Eggy 21:01, 8 Jun 2006 (EDT) ::::I think "you guys" (since you and Oz seem to be running this site) need to define how you want the site to expand beyond its original idea of only being history related. I THOUGHT you guys wanted it to be more encyclopedic (hopefully eventually swallowing up the other SL wikis) but now it seems Oz at least isn't sure. Oh and Oz, "telling you what to not do" is what a dictator does--tell his "people" how to act and behave according to HIS wishes. Bah. I won't even bother continuing to contribute here if THAT attitude will ensue. I'm really getting sick of people thinking they are god, lately: SL (where I've been suspended for 3 days because Torley felt I violated some TOS in this forum thread regarding spamming, trolling, or flaming--but who can tell since it's never clearly defined and pinpointed?), Wikipedia (Eep page was repeatedly deleted), IRC (Balaya--however it's spelled--banned me from #secondlife on EFnet for no good reason), Wiktionary ("wiktator" isn't good enough, apparently), and now here. Fucking ridiculous! -Eep 23:28, 8 Jun 2006 (EDT) :::::You were banned for being highly, abnormally and beyond the pale antagonistic to others, *especially* Ice Brodie, who was upset enough by your verbal assault that she actually left the channel and did not wish to come back until you were removed -- as well as your comments towards others that I will not get into at this time. This, as well as a refusal to at all correct your behaviors, got you the boot finally where you can join such fine luminaries such as Plastic Duck as one of the few people ever to be removed. If you think that I was the only person, let alone the only op who wished for you to be removed, you're sadly mistaken. However, if you wish to view this as 'no reason', you're certainly free to. --Belaya 16:16, 9 Jun 2006 (EDT) ::::::Oh please, Belaya. Ice Brodie had it coming due to her LSL Wiki antics. I wasn't antagonistic to others so I don't know what crack YOU are smoking. Oops, is THAT antagonistic too? Puh-leaze. You're just yet another power-hungry dictator op. -Eep 16:47, 9 Jun 2006 (EDT) :::::::In case it didn't occur to you, that place wasn't the LSL Wiki and your sudden attack on someone was quite unprovoked in the context of the setting. No one really cared about your little vendetta. I can see how productive this conversation is progressing, so I'll drop out of it. Feel free to make a nice Wiki entry on what a power-hungry, dictator op I am. Please use the words 'fascist', 'porkchop' and 'ninja' if you can. --Belaya 20:21, 9 Jun 2006 (EDT) ::::::::And in case it didn't occur to YOU, Belaya, Ice Brodie antagonized me first (on the LSL Wiki AND in #secondlife). If you recall (though I'm sure you'll selectively "forget"), the first time Ice saw me in the channel she asked if I had fixed my ACLs/permissions (not sure of the exact word she used) on my LSL Wiki pages. THAT is an antagonistic taunt yet *I* get banned from the channel for replying to her about it? Puh-fuckin'-leaze, dictator op. Stop being a hypocritical twit. -Eep 22:00, 9 Jun 2006 (EDT) :::::::::The funny part is there are visible places where Eep had harassed others well before I even took it upon myself to waste a solid week restoring various parts of the LSL Wiki to proper written order, stayed professional, and for the most part minded my own business. Yet the process which you acted included completely locking down over 6 pages of the LSL Wiki from editing, circomventing edits to remove pages with no relevense to LSL and then screaming about 3 or 4 well marked satire and humor pages while religiously defending your own with a hypacratical and obsessive fury. Though I post this after your permaban from 2 SL related wikis, SL (source, Eep's personal SL page). A ban from Wikipedia from before you joined SL, and amidst a 8 year mound of Usenet archives all stating that you will likely not fix your fanatical behavior until you likely are either on proper medication or have been attacked (or likely charged with some level of assult over a simular trivial issue). Welcome to the internet, if you're an agressive little snot, you get hated by the majority and delt with as an agressive annoying little snot. --Ice 03:36, 25 Aug 2006 (EDT) :"While on the one hand we are all certainly delighted that Wikipedia is growing in breadth, some (but not all) of us view breadth at the expense of the very notion of what we are working on--an encyclopedia--as a bad idea." -- ''What Wikipedia is Not' -- User:Schwartz G ::Whoever wrote that about Wikipedia is an idiot. Wikipedia IS an encyclopedia and there's nothing bad about it (except when wiktators decide what's encyclopedic and delete things). EVERYTHING is encyclopedic! People need to leave other people's contributions alone and simply EXPAND on them instead of mindlessly DELETING them just because THEY don't agree with it. Collaboration isn't about one person--or even a group of people (or even the majority)--it's about EVERYONE working TOGETHER. Sheesh! -Eep 23:28, 8 Jun 2006 (EDT) :::I think it was the people who own/run the wiki.. It certainly is not your wiki. If it was your wiki you would then be in charge of wiki and could set rules that no page be deleted and encourage total encyclopediacity. :::-Baba 15:19, 20 Jun 2006 (EDT) All that I know is that I've basically stopped working on my various projects until things settle down some and the recent changes list starts to contain more pages with actual useful content. -- Dyne 05:27, 9 Jun 2006 (EDT) : I'm sorry you don't feel like many of the recent additions don't contain useful content, Dyne. However, don't let that stop you from ADDING useful content relative to you. That's the cool thing about collaborative websites like wikis! :) I feel ALL content is useful to relative degrees--and it's all comprehensive. -Eep 06:45, 9 Jun 2006 (EDT) (proposals and discussion moved to Future plans for the wiki email to Adam Zaius about wiktatorship Hi, Adam, this is Eep Quirk from Second Life. I am emailing you with some issues I have with 2 of the SL History Wiki's admins, Oz Spade and Eggy Lippmann. I'm not sure if you've visited the wiki recently but it's getting a bit heated and I'm getting tired of the "wiktatorship" they (but mostly Oz) has over the wiki. Basically, the issue is with expanding the wiki's scope and its format (as explained on Future plans for the wiki). My point all along (as I elucidate on Talk:Future plans for the wiki) has been a single SL wiki that combines the SL History Wiki, SL Support Wiki (though it's more general), and the LSL Wiki. Oz and Eggy SEEMED to be behind the notion of turning the SL History Wiki into THE SL wiki, but not, it seems, they are having "cold feet" or something. Specifically, Oz said he wants to document SL's user interface but when I tried to create a page about what a window was and how it relates to SL, he deleted it and said it was too general. However, what he (and now Eggy, apparently) fail to realize is that just because a page may have little information on it (a "stub") doesn't mean it can't be expanded in the future. Eggy, too, supports (or supported anyway) interwiki linking but when I tried to create redirects to function from specific functions (llSetText et al), events, constants, etc, and Baba Yamamoto started changing some pages version 0.3.0, run, notecard, etc) to include LSL Wiki links directly (and repeatedly) in the same article, it got ridiculous. My mentality (Talk:Future plans for the wiki) for why all LSL Wiki functions should redirect to the SL History Wiki's function page and THEN provide a link to the LSL Wiki function list. But the first issue I had is when Oz changed the images on Edit Window (see Talk:Edit Window for more info). I'm getting REALLY sick of these wiktators and would like to vote they be removed from being admins and figured emailing you, since you host the wiki, would get the ball rolling. The wiki is supposed to be a COLLABORATIVE effort but collaboration can't occur if wiktators revert edits and can't (or simply won't) see reasoning. I have also asked for the other 3 admins to comment on these issues. 48 hour ban By overwhelmingly popular demand, the administration has decided to issue you two 24-hour suspensions, to be served consecutively. One for your blatant disregard of other people's wishes, even after clear rules were written and shown to you. The other for your personal attacks and general pattern of unpleasantness, generating conflict wherever you go. On a somewhat unrelated note, Oz and I co-founded this wiki. The other admins were added later and have gone inactive. We have no way of removing them from the list, sadly. You are still welcome to contribute to the history wiki after your ban expires. However, I should remind you that your ban time will double with each incident, thus growing exponentially until it exceeds the rest of your life I suppose ;) :48? Try 60... Wiktator... -Eep 06:29, 21 Jun 2006 (EDT) UI Pictures While the screenshots are appreciated would it be possible for you to turn off your custom colors.ini thing before taking one and uploading it? I know this isn't easy, I use a custom modified one too (and have replaced it and stuff before taking a screenshot for the UI). But I'd like the images to be as true to the UI as possible so there isn't any confusion, like in yours the text boxes look like they're disabled or something (I know they're not, but to someone new they may). Oz Spade 23:43, 15 Jun 2006 (EDT) :Yea, sorry, forgot about it in the recent screenshots that feature custom colors. I did it for the script window at least. :) However, the default disabled menu option color is too dark so I left my custom colors in for the help menu image (though it has no disabled options now that I look at it more carefully--ah well). -Eep 00:04, 16 Jun 2006 (EDT) Colors Lay off the colors, not EVERY word has to be its associated color. The only truely useful use of this I've found is for x y and z being in red green and blue approprietly. Other than that, every word that is a color doesn't need to be that color, people can grasp the concept of colors. Oz Spade 11:34, 20 Jun 2006 (EDT) :Color emphasises and attracts the eye. I like colors. Sue me, wiktator. -Eep 06:29, 21 Jun 2006 (EDT) ::Eep, can you please not use colors? I'm only asking because i've had several instances where I could not read the words that you colorized because my background color for this wiki is white. That's going to be the color most people see when they visit. Most difficult to read are aqua, bright yellows, and bright green. -Baba 15:22, 21 Jun 2006 (EDT) :::Alternatives are to: change the default background color to a more neutral (i.e. grey) color to better accomodate colored text or use a more neutral background on colored text like this, this, this, or this (mine). -Eep 16:02, 21 Jun 2006 (EDT) ::::It might work if everyone was using the same colors, but you can't expect them to have a nice dark background like you would prefer. It's not just about my ability to read the page, it's about everyone who visits the wiki and not being put off by incandesant colors on a white background. Even if everyone was using the same background and readability was not an issue, I don't think colors work in every situation a color word is used. I do like the use of color links on X, Y and Z when refering to the 3D axis. -Baba 10:39, 22 Jun 2006 (EDT)